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Gasoline Distillation Curves

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  • Duke W.
    Beyond Control Poster
    • January 1, 1993
    • 15667

    #46
    Re: Gasoline distillation curves

    Another point. The heat riser valve does not regulate inlet air temperature. There is no feedback loop for this function. It's a simple, crudely contolled device whose sole purpose is to create a "hot spot" at the base of the inlet manifold plenum (and in some cases the base of the carburetor where the idle/off idle discharge ports reside) in order to promote rapid fuel vaporization during engine warmup.

    It has to provide decent drive-off characterisitcs after a cold start at 20 below, but is probably not necessary in Phoenix during the summer, except for, maybe, the first minute or two after a cold start. Precise control of air A/F ratio was not important in the pre-emission era, so no attempt was made to do so. Carburetors were set up rich enough to avoid lean stumble due to cylinder to cylinder fuel distribution variation in order that the leanest cylinder didn't misfire.

    Heat riser valves degrade with time and miles due to thermal cycles, corrosion, and deposit build-up. The shaft can become sticky or jammed. I've observed heat riser valves that are closed on a fully warmed up engine in warm weather at idle, but if you blip the throttle, it opens up. This pumps way too much heat into the manifold and carburetor at idle and low load. I don't have one handy to inspect, but I think the shaft is offset from the center, so high exhaust flow will tend to open it up. If someone has one handy to inspect, maybe you can verify.

    The damned things are a PIA (notwithstanding the fact that they tend to rust out the right hand muffler prematurely), and many owners have found that wiring them open or replacing with the FI spacer improves overall engine behavior and drivability, except, maybe, for the first few minutes after a cold state since we rarely cold start and drive our vintage Corvettes in below freezing weather.

    In the emission control era a more consistent A/F ratio was required in order to meet emission targets. One solution was to install a heat stove on the exhaust manifold with a duct to a thermostatically controlled valve on the air cleaner snorkel. This maintained inlet air temperature at about 100F (except for a WOT override because the EPA emission certification test does not require the use of WOT, so WOT emissions were not an issue). With a regulated inlet air temperature, air density is closer to constant regardless of underhood or ambient temperature, which maintains the A/F ratio in a narrower range during normal idle and part throttle operation. The heat riser also heats the air from the carburetor and through the inlet manifold, and the temperature increase is greatest at low air flows, but no attempt was made to control air temperature beyond the carburetor entrance; however, the emission control engineers knew that "hotter is better" for fuel distribution equality, and the more equal the distribution, the lower the emissions.

    Control of the heat riser valve became a bit more sophisticated in the seventies. It's closed during cold start and warmup, but once coolant temperature reaches 180F a vacuum actuator opens it up fully and keeps it open at and above 180F. Since these engines have 195F thermostats, the valve is kept open all the time at normal operating temperature. The system is called EFE - early fuel evaporization.

    Duke
    Last edited by Duke W.; March 10, 2015, 02:21 PM.

    Comment

    • Steve G.
      Expired
      • November 24, 2014
      • 411

      #47
      Re: Gasoline distillation curves

      Originally posted by William Ford (50517)
      Steve,
      Reread my post. I stated that cause of problems should first be diagnosed in a logical fashion before making "fixes." But you seem to think the more underhood, manifold , carb heat the better. I, and many others disagree.Why did GM discontinue the under carb heat slot, install carb to manifold heat insulators/heat deflectors if we need so much heat? Why do we have cold air induction systems on many high performance engines? A heat riser is fine for cold starts but not so good after warmup in hot conditions. Are racers who uniformly block manifold heat passages wrong-at least from producing more horsepower point of view? This topic has been beat to death.
      William,
      Okay, it looks like we do need the long winded explanation.

      Part 1. Air fuel ratios talk about ratios in terms of molecules of each. A cubic foot of air contains different amounts of oxygen depending on it's temp. The colder the air, the more oxygen. So for a cubic foot of cold air, we need more fuel than we do for a cubic foot of hot air. That's why we need a choke (the FI system calls it an enrichener) to start the engine. Without that we wouldn't have enough fuel for the amount of oxygen for it to fire. It's called lean lean misfire. So we richen the mixture to get it to fire and run when cold.

      Part 2. Other than the choke the carb does not have a means to compensate for temps, temps that vary from day to day. An operating range of from -40F to 120F. Throughout that range of temps, if we can't vary the amount of fuel according to the temp, we need to make the temp constant. So no matter what temp the outside air is, the air having the fuel metered into it needs to always be about the same temp.

      Ideally, we would keep it at a constant cool temp. More oxygen can handle more fuel, bigger bang for our buck. But how do we cool the air down on a 120F day? It's very difficult to do. We would have to have a means of refrigerating the air to bring it's temp down on hot days. But it doesn't really matter what temp we regulate it to, as long as we meter an amount of fuel appropriate for air at that temp. This temp is not regulated by the engine coolant. It is the heat at the exhaust crossover and the base of the carb that is responsible for maintaining the air temp. When we talk about driveability until warm-up it is the air charge temp that has warmed up. The choke is fully off and the vehicle running normally.well before the coolant reaches temp. The spring on the heat riser is of a bi-metalic design, which helps it to control temps, but even without it, exhaust gas temps are pretty consistent thru-out normal driving circumstances.

      Part 3. As Duke's chart illustrates, different components of the fuel vapourize at different rates. The lower boiling point fuels are the ones that allow a cold engine to start. Liquid fuel doesn't burn, it's the vapors coming off them that do. When it is running on the lowest bp fuels the upper ones do not get completely burnt. They manifest themselves as deposits on the spark plugs and in the combustion chambers. In order for the fuel to completely burn we need to ensure that it, and the air it's suspended in, makes it to the temps that it will vapourize. It is the responsibility of the exhaust passages under the carb that are also responsible for that. So again, the quicker we get the air charge up to temp, the less unburnt fuel we have.

      Part 4. In addition to ensuring that the air charge reaches a temp that it can be held constant at and all the fuel will vapourize properly, the heat riser helps to regulate the heating of the choke so that it comes off in sync with the heating of the air charge.

      Why did they start to insulate the carbs and lessen the role of the heat riser. Because they moved to a heated air intake system using a heat stove on the exhaust manifold and a temp regulated blend door system in the air cleaner. We could now more accurately control the temp of the incoming air.

      Why do we install cold air intakes today? For the same reason we no longer use heat risers and air cleaner pre-heat systems. Because today's computer systems have the ability to adjust fuel easily by temp. Ambient air temps, intake temps, coolant temps are all monitored and fuel adjusted accordingly. So now, the cooler the air charge, the better the performance. But if you just cool the air without altering the fuel amount, it will run poorly. Current model cars with defective temp sensors run poorly.

      Cars modified with headers and no heat risers, and intakes with no exhaust cross overs are purpose built machines. They do not run properly through the same range of temps that the original design anticipated. For optimum performance at a track on a given day jets would be changed to correct for the air temp of that day. In the oe design, jetting and metering is set for the temp of the air that the heat riser and crossover consistently correct to.

      In short, it's not the amount of heat we want, it's the consistency of the temp we're after. And the only way achieve that was to raise it to a point that we could easily reach thruout the design operating range.

      Steve

      Comment

      • John M.
        Expired
        • January 1, 1998
        • 813

        #48
        Re: Gasoline distillation curves

        Check this out. It's a 69 tripower after shut down on a hot day. The engine is NOT running. Too bad the air fliter is on.

        This is my 69 front carb about a minute after shut off a few weeks ago. Its a lot louder then it really was, the camera mic was real close.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cm0kepzE3iU&feature=youtu.be

        Comment

        • John M.
          Expired
          • January 1, 1998
          • 813

          #49
          Re: Gasoline distillation curves

          Links not working

          Comment

          • Duke W.
            Beyond Control Poster
            • January 1, 1993
            • 15667

            #50
            Re: Gasoline distillation curves

            Geez, this is getting utterly ridiculous. I agree to disagree with everyone who disagees with me and you are welcome to do the same without prejudice.

            Maybe it's time for the moderators to put this one to bed.

            Duke

            Comment

            • George R.
              Expired
              • February 1, 2001
              • 19

              #51
              Re: Gasoline distillation curves

              Comment

              • Steve G.
                Expired
                • November 24, 2014
                • 411

                #52
                Re: Gasoline distillation curves

                I absolutely agree, both about putting it to bed and agreeing to disagree. I explained my position with the theories that support it and the science behind it where applicable. There is enough information on here for people to come to their own conclusions.

                Steve

                Comment

                • Don H.
                  Moderator
                  • June 16, 2009
                  • 2257

                  #53
                  Re: Gasoline distillation curves

                  CLOSED by popular demand.

                  Comment

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