1967 Body Lift for Chassis & Frame Restoration

[Richard M.]

Re: 1967 Body Lift for Chassis & Frame Restoration

If you recall the Driver's seat had this issue too which I fixed. But since I now had both seats out for underbody reinforcement work and now new carpets, I also managed to fix the Passenger seat latch lever floppiness while on the bench. It too was missing the lever anti-rattle spring.
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I'd bet the judges check that, at least by observation as if the spring is missing, the lever won't point to the sky as it should. Took it all apart and installed the spring, cleaned and lubed the latch mechanism, and all better now..... no more floppy rattly lever.
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BTW, you want to put a little hook on the straight end of the spring where it goes in the tube hole. This holds it better.

However, I noticed a crack in the backrest cover which needs attention too. It was getting late so I'll defer that repair to a later time. I have a plastic repair method I use which may work to ease it's conspicuousness. I'll show-n-tell if it works.
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Rich

[Richard M.]

Re: 1967 Body Lift for Chassis & Frame Restoration

It worked.

I used my baking soda and super glue method to repair the crack in the plastic backrest cover. All of my super glues were dried out so I had to take a trip later this morning to replenish it. This is how I did it. I have done this dozens of times on plastic pieces in the past. It's quite strong when it's done right.

First, tape the crack on the front side with vinyl electrical tape. Dust in some baking soda into the crack on the inside. Then drip the super glue(the thin type) into the crack and around the sides
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Sprinkle more baking soda on top of the puddle of glue to make a backing layer for strength. Give it a few seconds to cure and adhere and brush the loose soda off of the area.
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Remove the tape on the outside and mask off the crack on each side. drip in more glue into the front side to get full penetration of the soda into the backside. Remove the tape right away to wipe any that may have gotten under the tape. You now have a filled and repaired crack.
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Clean the area with some fine cut paintable polishing compound to clean any residue and dab in a little semi-flat paint with a artists brush. Lightly sand smooth withh 1500 paper and re polish with the compound. Fixed.
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After I get the hockey sticks back the seats will be reassembled and ready for the body when the carpets are back in. I cleaned and conditioned them to look much better. I also cleaned and refinished the silver pieces and latches. They will now look and work much better than before, with properly operating seatback latches and smooth unlock operation. I had to fight with them at first.
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Rich
p.s. I managed to see some sun outside today after working on the seats inside for fear of rain. I've been waiting for two weeks, when the monsoons came, to re-run the 427 for a while and make some adjustments. As it turns out the choke wasn't set properly and hard to start. Since I have no alternator for these tests I suspected lower than normal starting voltage so I tied a big battery charger in parallel with the battery and it helped much. I also used the new K & B TI module to get a better spark voltage. I readjusted the center carb idle screws 1 1/2 turns out on each as a baseline.

Engine cranked right over and started right up and fast idled properly. No more misses and ran fine. After a short warm up I was all ready to check timing etc and then the rain clouds appeared. Had to quit and bring the chassis back inside. It poured shortly afterward. Frustrated, I called it a day. Tomorrow is only 20% chance of rain as opposed to 90% most of the previous days of the week so there is hope.

===

[Richard M.]

Re: TI Transistor Ignition K66 Info

Yesterday I did a quick swap to replace the old type TI Module for the new advanced model from K & B Special Products, fellow member Ken Anderson's product. I did this as a extra confidence maker to run the engine up again. Worked great.

I've used quite a few of these over the last few years for '65's through '67's that I've worked on. Excellent product, better spark, and much more reliable than the original Delco type. I will be using the new module inside a original case after some external re-freshening of the case and backplate.

Here is the K & B module mounted in the unrestored extra case I acquired.
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The original case has the curved edge backplate, typical of the 1967 units. The circuit board was dated perfectly for a '67. Power Transistors dated October of 1966. I will test it later to see if it can be used as a spare.
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The Module that was previously on the car was a later replacement, as evidence showed due to the flat edged backplate. Earlier versions used the curved edge as above. Comparison photo below. I also have seen a extra ground biting lug on the later units, note lower right in photo. The rubbery gasket is important for a watertight seal. Later unit shown here.
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I removed the module by releasing the 3 mount screws, 2 at the corner and one at the lower middle. Note that this one had 3 different washer arrangements. The bottom center is the ground point. The other 2 are isolated from ground on the board. Carefully lift the edge to prepare for prying out the small transistor. I use a special mini hook tool for that. Same tool I use for stubborn midyear lock knob retainer clips. There is a small flat spring to hold the transistor. Remove that too.
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The 2 Delco Power Transistors and Trigger transistor are date coded. This will tell you the era of manufacture. This unit was assembled after June 6, 1969 so it was probably a OTC replacement for the defective original unit.
Pwr Trans 1960632 (9F06)June 6, 1969. Pwr Trans 1960584 (8H16)Aug 16, 1968, Trigger 1960643 6834(Week 34 of 1968).
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Back in the mid 70's when I worked in the Electronics Test Industry based in the Boston area, I used to travel around the country and the world working on computerized component and board test equipment. I used to visit Delco manufacturing plants where components like these were made. Seeing these old parts remind me of fruitful times in the industry which helped me raise our family and afford my first Corvette in the 80's. The good old days when we made everything here stateside. I miss those days.

Sorry for reminiscing, back to the task.

After cleaning the module case, which I still need to do and re-finish on this unit, the new circuit board is mounted using the same 3 screws. Ensure the toothed washer is there at lower center to ensure a good ground to the case. Then connect the 3 color coded leads to the circuit board, which has ID silkscreen notations. Make sure the terminals have clearance to the backplate. If not, bend the male terminals slightly at a angle to clear.
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After that, install the gasket and rear cover and screws and you're done. New advanced circuitry in a old original case.
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Thanks Ken

Rich

[Richard M.]

Movie Night

Since there was only a slight chance of rain today, I rolled the chassis outside for a cold start test. I set the choke to be fully closed and made sure the unloader worked properly. My battery is only 12.2 volts and I have the new K & B Module installed, so I wanted to give it a try using not-so-best-case conditions.

A few pumps and it started right up. I need more time and adjustments. It has a bit of a stumble off idle but I attribute that to not fully warmed up. I can only get it to about 140* F with my cooling setup. More experiments to come, but looking good.

Cold Start video here.....

https://youtu.be/8InATY5Na5s

Oil and Vacuum readings
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Engine about 80*(cold) along with about 85* ambient. Video is about 8 minutes long and gets boring but the first few minutes are good. It stopped recording at 8 minutes for some reason. Batteries were fine and plenty of memory. Maybe the engine shook the ground too much and shut it off.

My idle is a bit high, around 1050 and I ran out of adjustment on the idle screw. Partly probably a issue with static timing. Still need to set that. I tried after warm up but I could get a good start even with more manual advance on the distributor and raised idle. I'll tackle that next outing. I'm using a B26 Vacuum Advance, VC1765, not VC 1710 as I say in the video.

Manifold vacuum around 14-15 "Hg at idle. The B26 starts at 6" and all in at 12" with ( 8* Distributor / 16* Crankshaft ) advance so I've satisfied the 2" rule. More testing will determine if I have correct total timing under load conditions when the car is assembled and driveable. Using my Timing Light, at idle I'm reading about 24 degrees advance, so I need to check my static timing advance. It's a few degrees high. Distributor is properly aligned in the engine with the advance can in the middle of travel. Thinking more about my vacuum reading at idle......I'd think it would be lower with this solid lifter engine. Does 14 "Hg seem a bit high? It seems high to me.

Edit (John Hinckley just reminded me that Lars and Dukes vac can specs are for Distributor degrees, so I need to double that 8* to 16* and it appears I'm pretty close.) Thanks John.


Progress.

Rich

[Richard M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Kick Panel Screws

Oh the details, details.......

Back in my previous post about seats, here, the last set of photos show the "bumpers" in the wrong places. I just checked the JG and the steel bumper should be on the backrest, the plastic bumper on the seat bottom. Like this.....

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These seats when removed had them the other way and I followed what they did when I reassembled. The AIM gives part numbers for each but the P&A Books show no materials in their descriptions. AIM backrest bumper is 3903586. Bottom bumper is 3832010.

We are SURE about the orientation, right?

Now back to kick panel screws again. Refer to previous post here a few days ago. I thought I had the wrong screws, but it appears that I have mostly correct, I think.

I did see a notation in the JG that there's been "discussion" about kick panel screw usage. AIM says that all 6 are the same 4751359 screw. JG states 3 different types based on build time. This car had those(integral washer chrome) screws, qty 3 at the rearward trim side, 2 Phillips head trim for conical appearance at top and bottom, and that special "like the radio side panel but not exactly" screw at the forward tip.

I'm still confused but here are some photos for reference for future inquiring minds. The JG doesn't have detailed photos of the screws. If any of you folks that write the guides want any of these feel free if you feel it's pertinent and they're actual TFP parts.

What I removed...
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4751359 long screw at rear trims 3 places
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Trim screw (no washer) top/bottom center area
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Forward tip Screw (Part # unknown) The JG states that the forward screw is like the radio side panel screw but a "flatter" head. Here is what I think it is, however not certain.
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Here is the radio side panel screw I removed from those side locations. AIM shows part# 3777486
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Here are some closeups showing the head differences.
Radio screw left, "other" panel forward tip screw right(IMO). Radio panel has a more beveled edge, the "flatter" screw is noticeably flatter with no bevel.
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Rich

[Richard M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

These seats are killin' me.

Got the hockey sticks and ready to reassemble everything. Got one done after correcting some thick foam areas preventing the backrest latch from hitting the seat bottom. It was scratching at the vinyl for years. Bumpers in their right places now, confirmed elsewhere.

Then I notice the other seat as I begin assembly. Driver's side(where it came from, these are ambidextrous). The top of the backrest looked like this. A prior oops by someone who recovered these. Can't leave that.

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This is what it should be. Other one is about 1 3/4" to the piping.
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So I cut off the hog rings. I set it where it should be. But no place to hog it. There is another wire near the top but too loose there. Pretty obvious where the problem is....
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So I made a chain of hog rings to get it in the right place. Better.
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Fixed. The wrinkle has already flattened a bit after steaming.
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Both done with good working backrest latch operation as well. I'll steam a few more wrinkles out and all should be fine.
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During this fun task I got a call from my plating shop that the parts are ready so I took a ride to get them. Now I can get the rivets out and start putting the body pieces together before the new carpet and seats go back in. Also the alternator case restored and parts plated for reassembly and some other pieces to bolt back on. I need to check the alternator fan finish before assembly, SG black or gray IIRC.
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==

[Gene M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

Rich,
Going back to the kick panels. The screws you show that you removed from the door edge metal strip (3) I think was the intent to use in all 6 positions. But I find mostly the arrangement as you discovered on your car except the radio panel screw. The eyelet holes use the normal looking finish screw. My thinking is the metal strip end was assembled first and then the others that were more difficult to get to got the normal trim screws because they held better in the gun and cut there way better into the fiberglass. My very early 67 on the drivers side did not have the lower screw in fact there was no hole drilled for it. And yes judge did deduct for it missing. But he was just doing his job as that is not typical production. Oh, I should add too not all the eyelet screws made their way thru the eyelet and were just thru carpet and cardboard adjacent to eyelet. But I only seen one car like that.

[Richard M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

Rich,
Going back to the kick panels. The screws you show that you removed from the door edge metal strip (3) I think was the intent to use in all 6 positions. But I find mostly the arrangement as you discovered on your car except the radio panel screw. The eyelet holes use the normal looking finish screw. My thinking is the metal strip end was assembled first and then the others that were more difficult to get to got the normal trim screws because they held better in the gun and cut there way better into the fiberglass. My very early 67 on the drivers side did not have the lower screw in fact there was no hole drilled for it. And yes judge did deduct for it missing. But he was just doing his job as that is not typical production. Oh, I should add too not all the eyelet screws made their way thru the eyelet and were just thru carpet and cardboard adjacent to eyelet. But I only seen one car like that.

Thanks Gene.

So are you thinking these radio side panels screws not typical?

Rich

[Gene M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

Thanks Gene.

So are you thinking these radio side panels screws not typical?

Rich

Rich,
The only one not is the radio panel one used in the kick panel application. It would seem too short that GM workers would select it. But I'd never say never..... All the others are very original looking.

[Richard M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

Rich,
The only one not is the radio panel one used in the kick panel application. It would seem too short that GM workers would select it. But I'd never say never..... All the others are very original looking.

Okay I misunderstood. What you say makes sense too because it has to go through the kick panel as well as the vent. How will we ever know as the AIM is not decisive? (Rhetorical question). Need real original examples I'd imagine.

Thanks,
Rich

[Ara G.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

Okay I misunderstood. What you say makes sense too because it has to go through the kick panel as well as the vent. How will we ever know as the AIM is not decisive? (Rhetorical question). Need real original examples I'd imagine.

Thanks,
Rich

Rich,
I can shoot you some pics of originals if you would like this weekend. Let me know. ARA

[Richard M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

Rich,
I can shoot you some pics of originals if you would like this weekend. Let me know. ARA

Ara that'd be great thanks much.

Rich

[Gene M.]

Re: Seats Bumpers and Plating

Rich,
I suggest you assemble your car using the evidence it has. Understand there is always the possibility that the car was altered by previous owner. I was sharing with you my findings over the years on cars I had experience with thru one way or another. You are doing a wonderful task in sharing you restoration with the membership. Keep it going..........!

[Richard M.]

Re: Underbody Cleanup

Thanks Gene. I was thinking the same thing and will likely keep most of what I find intact with few exceptions which I know may be NTP. However I'm sure I'll make some mistakes. We'll see. I've been correcting some prior items, that even I myself did now that we're going to the next level.

-----

I spent the afternoon on parts runs and related activity. I found a pile of original radio condensers at a restomod builder's(buddie's) shop. Also looking for some other gadgets for the '67. Found a few other goodies he parted with too.

I needed a break today from yesterday's "fun" anyways. I spent a long afternoon under the car cleaning and removing paint that priors layered on when they sprayed black over that surfaced rusted frame to make it look prettier. I need to make it right before re-installing those refinished brackets and plated parts before body drop.

This is what made my neck and arms sore....(and brain). I had some of it cleaned a while ago but got to the rear section after the seats and had a real treat. Lots of black paint overspray and heavy application in some areas. Found some interesting primer coverage I'll ask about later. I know the blackout process up front can leave some paint on the front areas of the floors, and the rear had some blackout near the wheel wells but this seems excessive.
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Hard to see but that shiny black is pretty heavy. I started with some acetone, then lacquer thinner, then a little bit with #M Scotch Brite but it was getting scratched on a test area so I stopped.
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Had to progress to paint remover. What a nasty job. Done it before and not fun....but really needed on this one. After just a few seconds it curled the paint and even fell off in sheets in some areas. There was even some dark gray under the black over the diff and half shafts areas. They didn't even mask or paper off the body and painted that stuff mounted on the chassis. Therefore I know this black was not factory applied there.
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After some stripper reapplications on some areas I cleaned it all up with a acetone wipe down and looked a lot better back to black glass with those white fibers visible.
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So, when I got to the sides near the trailing arm areas, there's some very heavy red primer, both sides. Here's a question......
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Would the factory have put that much primer there and then would have to cover that with blackout?

It seems odd the factory would have wasted that much paint. I'm thinking it's from the lacquer repaint from 20+ years ago that we know of.

If I'm wrong and should not have removed it from the those 2 rear sides I can reapply blackout there.

Rich

[Ara G.]

Re: 1967 Body Lift for Chassis & Frame Restoration

Rich, pics sent. Feel free to pits them, as I don't know how. Lol