'64vin on '65 car

[James B.]

I have a friend with a '65 roadster. His problem is that someone pop rivited a 64 vin tag many years ago. He has talked with the original owner of the vin tag car and confirmed that car was destroyed. The 65 had the right trim tag and motor and trans have the same serial number so he believes between those and trim tag he has the correct vin number. Problem is while the car was sold by an Illinois dealer (don't know how he found that out) an Illinois title search indicated the car had never been registered in Illinois.
Can anyone suggest a resource he could go to that has a library of vin nos? This is probably an often asked question so apology in advance. I have told him Illinois records are not complete; also, car could have been bought by out of state customer from the local dealer. Obviously, he is also wary as car may have been stolen 30-35 years ago. Any help will be appreciated, Jim B

[Tom H.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Hi Jim !

I don't think you'll find a library of VINs anywhere. You really don't need a library to establish the VIN if you believe the engine and transmission contain the original VIN for the car. What he will have is big problems selling or registering this car in some states. Sounds like a big problem waiting to happen.

[Tom H.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Hi Jim !

I don't think you'll find a library of VINs anywhere. You really don't need a library to establish the VIN if you believe the engine and transmission contain the original VIN for the car. What he will have is big problems selling or registering this car in some states. Sounds like a big problem waiting to happen.

[Mike M.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

what's the vin derivative that's stamped on the frame? if the frame, engine and tranny have same vin #, good chance the 65 was , at one time, a hot potato. if he were inclined, he could have state troopr , run the engine etc vin # , but it may well cause him a mega-migraine. mike

[Mike M.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

what's the vin derivative that's stamped on the frame? if the frame, engine and tranny have same vin #, good chance the 65 was , at one time, a hot potato. if he were inclined, he could have state troopr , run the engine etc vin # , but it may well cause him a mega-migraine. mike

[Joe L.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Jim------

In the "old days" many Corvettes were stolen. Many of these were never recovered. That's because they "assumed the identity" of other Corvettes, usually cars that had been otherwise destroyed (just like in this case you described). A VIN tag switch, exchange of registration certificate between cars, and that's about all there was to it. The theory behind this was that before anyone ever finds out about it, the car will be ready for the boneyard. The problem is that old Corvettes didn't suffer the same "life cycle" as most other cars. So, many of the "sins of the past" are "cropping up" today.

When one finds a Corvette that the numbers don't all line up, one should be very cautious. In my opinion, no one should EVER EVEN CONSIDER purchasing an old Corvette unless one confirms that the frame-stamped VIN derivative matches the VIN number on the VIN plate. No match = no purchase. Period.

Sure, a lot of this "funny business" happened years ago. No matter, a stolen car then is a stolen car now. It doesn't become "cleansed" because a lot of time has passed and the car has been through several owners. It doesn't become "cleansed" because an insurance company has, in SOME case, made whole the owner at the time of the theft. The ONLY way a stolen car ever can become "cleansed" is if it's recovered and returned to its rightful owner, be that an insurance company or otherwise.

In my opinion, as Corvette hobbyists and aficionados we should be as absolutely dedicated to that principle as anyone. After all, how would you feel if the car stolen had been YOUR car?

[Joe L.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Jim------

In the "old days" many Corvettes were stolen. Many of these were never recovered. That's because they "assumed the identity" of other Corvettes, usually cars that had been otherwise destroyed (just like in this case you described). A VIN tag switch, exchange of registration certificate between cars, and that's about all there was to it. The theory behind this was that before anyone ever finds out about it, the car will be ready for the boneyard. The problem is that old Corvettes didn't suffer the same "life cycle" as most other cars. So, many of the "sins of the past" are "cropping up" today.

When one finds a Corvette that the numbers don't all line up, one should be very cautious. In my opinion, no one should EVER EVEN CONSIDER purchasing an old Corvette unless one confirms that the frame-stamped VIN derivative matches the VIN number on the VIN plate. No match = no purchase. Period.

Sure, a lot of this "funny business" happened years ago. No matter, a stolen car then is a stolen car now. It doesn't become "cleansed" because a lot of time has passed and the car has been through several owners. It doesn't become "cleansed" because an insurance company has, in SOME case, made whole the owner at the time of the theft. The ONLY way a stolen car ever can become "cleansed" is if it's recovered and returned to its rightful owner, be that an insurance company or otherwise.

In my opinion, as Corvette hobbyists and aficionados we should be as absolutely dedicated to that principle as anyone. After all, how would you feel if the car stolen had been YOUR car?

[James B.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Thanks for the responses. He looked on the frame and could fine no stampings. Yes, good chance it was a stolen car. The shame is he bought the car 30 years ago and didn't know the difference then ('64 v '65). Jim B

[James B.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Thanks for the responses. He looked on the frame and could fine no stampings. Yes, good chance it was a stolen car. The shame is he bought the car 30 years ago and didn't know the difference then ('64 v '65). Jim B

[Joe L.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Jim------

They are difficult to see, but there should be a VIN derivative stamping on the frame. Very few car thiefs are going to go through the trouble of removing a body from the frame to obliterate and/or re-stamp numbers.

It is possible that someone might have tried to obliterate the numbers with the body on the frame. That could be done. However, the grinding marks should be quite obvious. I'd recommend re-cleaning and re-checking the frame for numbers.

[Joe L.]

Re: '64vin on '65 car

Jim------

They are difficult to see, but there should be a VIN derivative stamping on the frame. Very few car thiefs are going to go through the trouble of removing a body from the frame to obliterate and/or re-stamp numbers.

It is possible that someone might have tried to obliterate the numbers with the body on the frame. That could be done. However, the grinding marks should be quite obvious. I'd recommend re-cleaning and re-checking the frame for numbers.

[Joe L.]

Addendum

One other thing he could do to clean the frame if the numbers don't show up. Use a small wire wheel on a Dremel tool to thoroughly clean the top of the frame rail in the area. This should expose any stamped number OR and grinding/sanding that may have been once performed.

[Joe L.]

Addendum

One other thing he could do to clean the frame if the numbers don't show up. Use a small wire wheel on a Dremel tool to thoroughly clean the top of the frame rail in the area. This should expose any stamped number OR and grinding/sanding that may have been once performed.

[James B.]

Re: Addendum

Joe, thanks for the follow-on note. Yes, I have worked to bring up frame stamping nos on a couple of cars I have restored. The car in question has never had the body off. At some point he is going to have to lift the body. Tnx again, Jim Baker

[James B.]

Re: Addendum

Joe, thanks for the follow-on note. Yes, I have worked to bring up frame stamping nos on a couple of cars I have restored. The car in question has never had the body off. At some point he is going to have to lift the body. Tnx again, Jim Baker