Re: hair brained idea for sure--pre-oil/prime yes!

[Rainer S.]

I guess, thats why I asked this Forum. I didn't think much of this suggestion either, have never heard of it until my friend suggested it. He had given me very good advise in the past.
But it does not hurt to ask. I appreciate the the good advise I have read on this forum.
As I mentioned in my post, I have a "preluber", which I made out of an old distributor (another trick I learned of this Forum). I used it once on this engine and will use it again , just before starting the engine.
I have been using CI-4 diesel oil in my 2004 Jetta diesel, but did not use it in my Corvette engine for the initial start-up (didn't know about it 2 1/2 years ago), and neither did I use the GM EOS additive.
(I use Mobil 1 synthetic oil in my other cars.)
I remember reading Your extensive write-up on this Forum about the CI-4 oil and GM EOS additive usage, there is quite a bit of info available when you Google CI-4 and GM EOS additives.
Thanks for setting me straight, I am not sorry I asked...

Rainer

[Joe L.]

Re: hair brained idea for sure--pre-oil/prime yes!

Rainer-----

I had never heard of this practice before. However, as I think about it, I'm not so sure that it's such a bad idea. By effectively "submerging" most of the engine's moving parts with oil, one much better ensures that everything will be properly lubricated on start-up. As long as one removes the excess oil before start-up, I can't see what harm it could do.

Also, this might be a great idea for long-stored engines, ensuring corrosion protection for all the "submerged" components.

[Duke W.]

More motor oil information

Just to remind everyone, regardless of whether an oil is "synthetic" or conventional base, if the API service category is SM, it is not a very good choice for VINTAGE engines, and you DEFINITELY want to avoid the "energy conserving" types that typically have 10W or lower winter viscosity ratings. Those of you who refuse to let go of your cherished Mobil 1 (remember, I am talking about VINTAGE, not modern engines) need to do some research and analysis.

Modern spark ignition engine oils are designed for modern engines with roller everything and the additive package, particularly the ZDDP antiwear additive, has been reduced in SM to extend the life of catalytic converters, NOT the engine itself.

API CI-4 HD diesel engine oil has a much richer additive package than SM including more ZDDP, and it's the additive package that counts, not the base oil. All modern base oils are good. Even today's Group I bases are vastly superior to base oils from 30 years ago, and most Group I bases have to have some Group II or Group III added to meet today's very tough oxidation test standards. All conventional base blends are perfectly fine for 5000 miles or one year of service, whichever comes first.

Until about 10 years ago a true synthetic was either a Group IV polyalphaolefin or a Group V ester. However, a court decision allowed Group II and Group III bases that are refined from petroleum by hydrotreating to be called "synthetic" and declared that "synthetic" is a MARKETING term, not a technical term, and that is the case today. Virtually all base stocks have at least some "synthetic" in the blend, and most "full synthetics" are primarily Group II with maybe a little Group III. Group IV and V are now rarely found in any significant quantity in automotive oils, including all the popular brands.

The extended life benefits of synthetics due to their slower oxidation rate offer no significant benefit to vintage cars that see low annual mileage, and oil should be changed AT LEAST once a year regardless of mileage. The same applies to synthetic's wider viscosity range. If you don't typically drive your car in below zero weather, you don't need a 0W-40. The 15W-40 range typical of CI-4s is fine for cold starts down to about 15F and the hottest weather you will drive in.

Most stores are now carrying the new CJ-4 oil for new diesel engines that operate on low sulfur fuel and have catalysts. CJ-4 has less ZDDP anti-wear additive than CI-4, but more than SM.

You may have to find a parts store that caters to the medium and HD truck trade to find CI-4. It is still being manufactured, but distribution is thinner.

If you want to take a much deeper dive into this subject the following two web pages are recommended. The first is a good overview and look at all the links. The second is much longer and is focused at vintage Porsche engines, but the same arguments can be used for vintage Corvette engines, especially when it comes to valvetrain loading.

http://lubricants.s5.com

http://www.lnengineering.com/oil.html

Duke

[Duke W.]

Re: hair brained idea for sure--pre-oil/prime yes!

The best way to get oil in critical areas is to use a pre-oiler that forces oil into all the clearance spaces with pressure.

If you filled the engine up - several gallons of oil would be required, and I have no doubt that over time it will leak out seals and gaskets, which are not designed to hold back hydraulic pressure. Plus you would have to eventually dispose of several gallons of oil.

Corrosion is not a big issue in stored engines as long as they have fresh oil and as long as they are not stored in a condensing humidity enviroment. A new engine that is expected to be stored should have all internal surfaces coated with oil - a paint brush works well. And an engine that is stored after running - even briefly - will have a film of oil on all internal surfaces.

There are even many cases where cars that were left outside in the elements with no storage prep survived many years to run once again without major work, but that's a crapshoot.

Duke

[Lyndon S.]

Re: More motor oil information

how much of the GM EOS should one add to the new CJ-4 oils to get the ZDDP up to the old levels?

[Duke W.]

Re: More motor oil information

From the second link:

"How can I boost the level of Zn and P?

One way would be to use GM's Engine Oil Supplememental additive. By our calculations, between .5 and .66 oz of GM EOS has to be added to each quart of oil to raise the Zn and P by 100 ppm each."

Say about 4 oz. of EOS a 5-6 quart total system capacity would increase the Zn and P concentration about 150-250 ppm and this would bring the CJ-4s to near the level of the CI-4s that were tested, so one bottle of EOS is good for four oil changes.

ZDDP is consumed with use, so if you only drive a few hundred to a few thousand miles between annual oil changes, I don't think you really need to add any EOS to CJ-4, but it won't hurt.

Duke