I'm a new NCRS member and I'm looking for my first Corvette. I figured it would be a first good step to join NCRS. I do have a question regarding my search for a C2 vette. That question is: I would like to find a 67 327/350 coupe with AC but many cars I've looked at so far don't have any docs so how would I know if the car is really a 350 hp car not a 300 hp car w/re-stamp and 350hp dress? From what I've seen so far it wouldn't be hard to fake a 350 hp car. Thanks in advance for sharing your expertise.
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Re: New Member
Welcome aboard Paul,
You are correct, a 67 L-79 350 HP with A/C is a very desireable combination and a little difficult to find, but they're out there. The problem is, real documentation is scarce, but phony reproduction paperwork is now quite common and it's almost impossible for most people to tell the difference. Also correct on the fact that an L-79 is an easy car to fabricate from a base engine 300 HP car. It's just "parts" away from being undetectible L-79. There were no special mod's to the body that would be difficult to hide, that I can think of. Good luck with your search. -
Re: New Member
You done good. Join NCRS read, study, learn BEFORE you buy your first Corvette!!!
Now, consider taking another step and joining + getting active in your local chapter. There, you'll find guys who've been around the block, know who has what cars in your neck of the woods + who has what parts & provides what services without ripping you off. You just might find the car of your dreams around the block!
To answer your question exactly, without some form of audit trail (tank sticker, prior ownership history, original sales order, Etc.), it's not really possible to absolutely/positively determine a car's configuration authenticity. Some 'restorers' are SO GOOD just about anything can be made after the fact.
Plus, to make matters worse, some of these cars were raced, wrecked, and pieced back together leaving the 'forensic audit trail' (determine configuration by the presense/absence of other supporting telltale components) clear as mud....
On the other hand, think for a minute. If you're out to 'fake' a car, are you going to rifle shot a 67 small block? The big $$$ lie in making up a low production, high horse, BB car from that timeframe. So, if you encounter an eighty year old fella who's the first owner of the car, it's probably safe to conclude he didn't 'cook' the car....Comment
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Re: New Member
Paul ..welcome!
The first thing I would check on a mid year is the frame. I would thoroughly inspect the car off the ground and check for rust.
If the car has a rusted through frame the body will hold it together for a while..but it is a major expense to fix.
JoeComment
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Re: New Member
Paul! they can fake anything C1 and C2 and also have all the paper work needed to prove it. Some one that has owned their Corvette for YEARS is your best bet it's realComment
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Re: New Member
Welcome Paul! You are doing what I REALLY wish I had done first - join, listen, learn - then work on the car. This is the best forum for spot on information, great people to learn from - very informative - Welcome!!Comment
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Re: New Member
Mike
I hope you can find a 67 small block they get rarer every day. GM made about a 50-50 split but today I see about 10 to one. All the small blocks must be at home and under cover.
LyleLyle
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Re: New Member
Welcome Paul,
If someone dressed up a 300HP to look like a 350HP they may have not finished the rest of the drive train. There were some engine, tranny, rear axle ratio combinations for a 350HP car that were not available for a 300HP car and visa versa. Just another area to look at.
WayneComment
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Re: New Member
Hi Paul:
Welcome aboard! In 2002 I set out to purchase a "real" 67 factory air small block convertible. I did what you have done, which was to join the NCRS first and try to become an educated buyer. It was the best thing I could have done. In 2004 I purchased a car that has turned out to be a pretty good one.
I recommend that you join your local chapter and begin attending chapter events to get to know the experts in your local chapter.
My strongest recommendation is that you have an experienced NCRS judge look at any car you are considering. Some of the candidate cars may be in other states, but you can still have an experienced judge look at the car for you. One option is to fly someone out to see it, but another option is to call the chairman of the NCRS chapter located where the car is, and ask if someone in the local chapter could check the car for you.
The typical charge to have an experienced judge look at the car and provide a written report will be $100 to $300, which is money well spent. Experienced judges know all the places to look for the tell-tale signs of hidden damage or bogus cars.
Regarding the specifics of your posting, I have two comments:
1) Only about 1-in-5 1967 Corvettes had factory air. If you start adding other criteria such as 350 horse engine, coupe, specific body/interior color combination, and verified original drivedtrain, you may diminish the percentages to 1-in-1000 or worse. I suggest that you make a prioritized list of what parameters are "mandatory" and what parameters are "preferred." Then stick to the list and be patient. It may take a year or two to find what you want, but having clear criteria will help you avoid wasting time on cars that are not really what you want.
2) You mention that it "wouldn't be hard" to change a 300 HP engine to a 350 HP engine, but the engine codes on the pad are different so the change would require a pad restamp. Part of having an expert evaluate a car is to try and avoid restamped pads (some restamps are readily detectable but others will fool even the experts). So, the process of changing the original 300 HP engine to a 350 HP is not much different from from someone putting a completely non-original engine in the car and restamping it to appear original. I think the latter case is much more common than the former.Comment
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Re: New Member
Thanks for all of the good advise guys. I'm sure I'll have a few more questions to post as I get a little more "educated". I'll be checking out the car corral in Auburn on Saturday. Thanks againComment
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Re: New Member
-------Paul,,,It was nice talking to you today. I called Joe after our conversation and while talking to him found alot of old owner info that I didnt know I had in that cars file. Those that know me know Im not generally that organised. It must be my wifes fault. If you have any other questions just yell. Id love to see you buy that old car as it is a special one. At Bloomington Gold one year Chip Miller and Bob Gold (RIP twice over) were looking the car over and I flipped them the keys. They came back about a half hour later with huge grins on their faces. Im telling you, it was the exhaust, solid lifters and the 4:11s. You will never miss the AC and Ill bet you will never turn the radio on!!!!!.......Bill SComment
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