Ok, I drove a 427/435 side pipe car and loved the sound and performance. I'm going to drive a 396 tomorrow. Can it give the same visceral thrills of the 435?
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1969 Riverside Gold Coupe, L71, 14,000 miles. Top Flight, 2 Star Bowtie. -
Yes...STOCK
Hi Chris:
From my experience, without a doubt. If it runs like those I have had the pleasure to drive, they're are among the fastest STOCK Vettes I have encountered. I like em'
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Re: 65 396 question
Chris --- If the L78 vs L71 "VISCERAL" stock comparison is to be made between the same body style, the tops should be either both up or down if convertibles, or up if the comparison is with a coupe. Probably the biggest "un-equalizers" will be a difference in rear end gearing, and tires.
If you could take both cars to the Bonneville flats, and drive them with one of those blind hoods that IFR pilot trainees use, I don't believe you'd notice a visceral difference between the tripower and the 396.
Just MHO.Comment
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Re: 65 396 question
Chris: I have to admit that I've never driven a 435 car but I do have the pleasure of owning an L78 with side pipes. It is a BLAST to drive. And the L-78 is rarer than the 435 as well. My bet is you'll love it. I am a little prejudiced here, could you tell?
I agree that with the minimal difference in HP between the two engines, changes in rear end gearing would probably provide a more discernable performance differential than the engines themselves. Mine is a 411. YOOHOO!Comment
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Re: 65 396 question
As previously mentioned it depends on the gears. One thing to remember if it doesn't have side exhaust,is the sound of the solid lifters will be heard. I love that sound.I have factory side pipes on my 67 B/B and it drowns out my lifter noise somewhat. The car should run like hell if it has good gears and the correct carb/single four barrel holley. I put that same engine in my 64 conv. back in the early 70s,And it ran very well. Good engine.GRR#33570Comment
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Re: 65 396 question
Well, I drove it and it the scared the F### out me. That thing was fast! It seemed faster than the 435.1969 Riverside Gold Coupe, L71, 14,000 miles. Top Flight, 2 Star Bowtie.Comment
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Re: 65 396 question
Chris, I told you so. That 435hp L-71 engine is basically the same but it has more cubes and 3/2s. The 66 425hp with a single four barrel would run the same as your L-78 if matched with same gears if not faster. I have always known the 427/425hp with 4.11 gears to be a mid 13 sec. street machine if properly driven. We did it when the cars were new.
The 435hp L-71 has the basic block of the 66 425, difference is the carbs. Even though I own a 67 L-71 coupe I used to blow them off the street because most of them had tall gears and the drivers didn't know how to race or tune a car.
The key to going fast quick is good gears, a good eshaust system and at least 4.11 gears. Short shifting out of 1st gear and getting into high gear ASAP. You don't wind up a big block like a small block, to much torque. I can only tell you I have blown up enough big blocks racing from experience. then I learned how to race.
Cubes means torque and the sooner you get into high gear the better. Also knowing how to tune up a car. That is key to any engine. Most people don't. They can't set valves (solid lifter cam eng.) which effects timing and they don't know how to get the most out of the engines. An engine is no more than a air pump,air in-exhaust out. I have always power timed my engines to get the most out of them. I have run 3.70 to 5.38 gears on the street.
So that L-78s owner probably drives and the car like it was 1965. Getting with the program. All the cars I have restored I restored with the intention to race except for the late model jobs like my 90 ZR1.No comment.
On my 67 I have the lightest springs possible in by front and after carbs since they work off vacuum. I have 4.11 gears also which helps get my vacuum down sooner to open the carbs so I won't bog. I really want to put a set of headers on it but I would destroy the value of the car. I do have the factory option side exhaust. So I'll play it straight on the exhaust side.
Also I'm sure if the car ran well the owner had some good leaded sunoco 130 or equal fuel. Thats what I use. There are a lot of members who power tune their cars and run good gears/fuel so when they hit the streets like that 65 L-78 they are ready to get it on.
Also keep in mind some of these owners just drive the cars as a hobby and don't want to blow up and expensive engine. I an appreciate that.
If your shopping you'll find both types. Nothing wrong with having a weekend driver instead of a weekend worrior.
When you drive these cars ask the owners what type of fuel/gears and timing do they run. Ignition timing,tall gears, unleaded fuel and you'll have a handle on what to expect, weekend worrior or weekend driver.Glad you had fun.GRR#33570Comment
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Re: My kinda Vette guy!
Geez GR,
I couldn't have said it better. I'm just a youngster by Discussion Board standards (but I can't help it if I was delivered late to the party).
I was a kid growing up around the Mid-year cars and early Sharks and have liked them both. For weekend driving I've got an original engine 68 L89 with a 4:11 rear, and I'm running straight 104 octane racing fuel. I don't hassle other drivers, but on the street I intend to drill anyone that's curious enough try it. Just one question, what's your initial timing set at? TBarr #24014Comment
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Re: 65 396 question
i dug out my old records and my 425hp 396 ran 13.0s with road race tires. my wifes time for the 396 was 13.30s. it was equipted with 4.11 gears. this was in 1965 when you could get 100 octane fuel.
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Re: My kinda Vette guy!
Tom, As all gun fighters of the old west did, draw first. As for your question I'll just say I get as much advance as my engine will give me w/out effecting my performance. But the real key if you have the gears and torque is getting into high gear ASAP and the tires to get you there. Short shift first and don't drive the big blocks like a small block.
Case in point,I had a friend who drove nothing but 289s (sorry to mention ford) back in the 60s. Then he got a 428. He tried driving and winding that big block up like a 289. One night out at Sacramento Raceway he blew the bottom end of his engine all over the track. But he did get into the 13s that night but at a high cost.We all ran on stock tires back then.
Sounds like you use good fuel also, just play with your timing until you get to feel your dialed in. Best place is the strip on fun nights. I would feel like a village idiot if I told you or anyone where I set my advance and something happened to your engine. Have Fun-GRR#33570Comment
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Re: My kinda Vette guy!
GR,
Thanks. I didn't mean to imply that I would set my timing at your timing, but something else is, around what RPM are you short shifting? TBarr #24014Comment
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Re: 65 396 question
Motorman --- I continue to marvel at the 1/4 mile times with the first big blocks. While doing a newspaper archive search on my 396 (delivered new and spent the next 23 years in the West Louisiana/N.E. Texas area), I wrote down local Corvette drag results: B/SP '66 L72 12.58 sec; '65 L78 C/SP (driven by Gene Alleman) 12.33/10.71/10.26/10.78 (at various meets throughout the spring and summer of '67), and the same car at the '67 Indy Nat'nls: 11.75 sec @ 118.26 mph (won class but disqualified for removing spare tire carrier). Now I don't know what C/Sports class rules were, but I think this car had Curtis drag slicks, Hurst shifter, Doug Thorley headers (into otherwise stock N14 side exh), and from a photo of the L78, it has slicks on stock steel rims.Comment
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Re: My kinda Vette guy!
Tom, I'm short shifting my 67 L-71 at about 5500 RPM, 4.11 rear end, lightest springs possible in f/a carbs with as much advance as the engine will respond to without hp/torque loss. If you have a track or safe place to test/tune your car it may react differently. Basically its trial and error to get dialed in. This is with stock red line radials which don't help matters. Best thing to do is go to a local strip and dial in the car and see where it leaves and runs the best times at with street tires. I never like to go up in smoke and thats what you want to avoid. Your engine may me stronger than mine so you sorta have to go one step at a time. Just remember smoking is bad for your health and worse when your cars sitting at a stop light smoking the tires as the other guy leaves you sitting there. I know that feeling, "Exit right". Good Luck GRR#33570.Comment
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Re: My kinda Vette guy!
GR,
Thanks for all your input. I'm running redline radials also, and the car has it's original N11 exhaust. I realize this is sort of like instructing someone how to put the arrow through the bullseye over the phone, but I have just the resource for testing. Thanks again.Comment
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Re: 65 396 question
those times i posted were just as it came, no headers or anything. i bored out several to 427 size and they did not run any better,due to traction problems. with slicks they would do better.
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