Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

[Steve Antonucci]

Hi everyone,

I found this BB exhaust manifold on "the bay". The seller claims that it is
original right down to the overspray. I was wondering if any members here
would comment on the amount of overspray this manifold has. The evident drip
is of interest to me as is the amount of overspray on the lower outlet portion
of the manifold.

Seller claims this came on a crate L-88 engine in 1969 and went onto a shelf
shortly thereafter.

Comments?.......

Steve

[Joe L.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Steve------

I also saw this manifold for sale on eBay. I think this may be it's "second-time-around". I am quite confident that this manifold is just like the seller represents. It looks like an original factory paint job to me. In fact, I believe that it gives a rarely seen "insight" into just exactly how these manifolds were originally painted.

The one thing that I might note is this: GENERALLY crate engines are sold without exhaust manifolds. However, this applies to SERVICE-only crate engine assemblies. PRODUCTION engines, which are sold in SERVICE during the same period that they are used in PRODUCTION, generally DO have the exhaust manifolds installed. So, I would expect that these manifolds came off a PRODUCTION engine that was sold in SERVICE.

[Steve Antonucci]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Joe,

That's why I posted it. Sadly, this is a topic of much interest to me.
Well, this and intake manifold overspray. Don't worry, I'll get a life
one day.....

BTW, what explains the overspray on the outlet ( lower portion )?

Steve

[Joe L.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Steve-----

I expect that the outlet was just painted along with everything else. However, the paint does seem "thinner" in the lower area (as I would expect). Engine painting was not a precision painting operation, at all. Also, keep in mind that for all the paint that got on the exhaust manifolds, there were resultant "holidays" on the block area behind the manifolds.

[Michael H.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Steve,

In my opinion, it would need quite a bit more orange paint to be considered original. It would be highly unlikely there would ever be much paint on the cyl between the manifold runners if that's the extent of color on the manifold itself. With pressure feed spray equipment, it's not possible to spray small areas as those shown on the individual runners.

John Hinckley could tell us roughly how much time was allowed for each engine paint operation but I'd guess it was measured in seconds, not minutes. There wasn't time to paint isolated areas without getting a lot on other near surfaces, especially between the runners.

I know someone that has/has a few "take-off" manifolds from brand new engine assemblies. I'll see if I can get him to post and describe the amount of coating.

Many new 396-427 take-off manifolds came from people that were racing boats in the 60's. They were buying new complete engine assemblies and if you went to their shops, you saw a lot of these manfolds on shelves with all of their orange paint. A lot more than on the ebay manifold. .

[Michael H.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Steve,

It just reread your first post and it occured to me that I missed the part about this manifold being from a new 69 L88 crate engine assy. If that's the case, there wouldn't have been any paint at all on the upper legs of the manifold because the valve covers and aluminum cyl heads wouldn't have been painted at all.

[Joe L.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Michael------

The seller SAYS that it was originally installed on an L-88 engine. That doesn't mean that it was an L-88. It may well have been some other big block that has "morphed" into an L-88 after 35 years of time and memory. The manifold appears unused, has a late 1969 date, the paint color looks right, and it is GENERALLY painted the way I would expect for a factory manifold. I can see absolutely no reason that anyone would have, in 1970 or so, painted a manifold IN THIS MANNER and then leave it unused for 35 years. So, regardless of what engine this manifold was originally attached to, I am 99.9% convinced that it was painted at the Tonawanda factory.

[Michael H.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Anything is possible but I've seen a LOT of new BB engine assy's and a lot of take off manifolds but I've never seen one with paint that looked like this. If it's that light on the manifold flange area that bolts to the head, how much paint could possibly be on the head itself. It is possible but it definitely isn't even close to typical.

[Mark #28455]

I don't believe it

I have personally owned several original aluminum cylinder heads with the original orange overspray on them. The heads on my 1969 L89 built Feb 1969 had a fair amount of overspray on the sides of the heads, up to the undersurface of the exhaust ports and there was no "missing" coverage as would have been blocked if the heads were painted with the manifolds on. I also own a November 1968 842 head that was a dealer warranty takeoff and had only the lower 3/4" painted again with no "masking" effect from the manifolds. I also own a pair of early 1968 model heads that were a takeoff (including valves and spark plugs - never run) that don't seem to have any paint at all on them, so I doubt the later heads were painted with the manifolds on.
Hope this helps,
Mark

[John H.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

I spent a lot of time at Flint Engine, but I was only at Tonawanda once; I don't recall if the paint booth at Tonawanda handled the output from both the small-block and big-block assembly lines, or if each of the two lines had their own paint booth.

At Flint Engine, the output from Line #1 (170-180 per hour) and Line #2 (110-120 per hour) were combined ahead of the paint booth; they went through the booth at 300 per hour, or one every twelve seconds - hardly enough time for a precise painting operation.

[Michael H.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Thanks John. Incredible numbers for the time to paint a complete engine. I've never been to the Tonawanda plant but my original guess on time was around 30-45 seconds per engine. Twelve seconds is even more incredible. It would have been more of a "pull the trigger and run" operation. No time to stop between exhaust manifold runners, and with the huge amount of material pouring out of those guns, it's not surprising the manifolds were coated as heavily as they were. Wish I would have seen that operation when the 60's big blocks were rolling through.

[Dick W.]

Re: Tonowanda plant exhaust manifold overspray

Tonawanda had a bulletin issued in 1968 basically stating due to the new air quality regs, the exhaust manifolds were not to be painted. However we have observed low mile original 68 and later big blocks with very minor overspray on the tops of the manifolds, but not to the extent in the photo.

[Verne Frantz]

'62 Tonawanda. For reference only

This photo was taken in late '62. Some paint can still be seen even though a lot has already been burned off the heads as well. It's also interesting to note where other orange overspray occurs.

[Verne Frantz]

Sorry. URL link didn't work *NM*

[Verne Frantz]

Trying again *NM*