Has anyone tried the R-134A+? It claims to cool 50% better than R-134A.
Thanks,
Scott
Thanks,
Scott
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
I assume you want this for a car designed for 134A.
My car is desined for R12 and I am running 134A and not satisfied. Would I be a candidate for R12a or R134A+? Is there a website for R134a+ that I could "go to school on".
Randy -
Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
Why not use one of the R12 replacements. IE: Autofrost or Freeze 12.Comment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
Randy, I converted my full size '93 Blazer and my '66 Impala to R-134 and like you I don't care for it. I still have six cans of R12 for my '70 Corvette. I was in O'Reilly's last week and I spotted the R134A+ but no one seemed to know anything about it. I had my mechanic pick up the only three cans they had. Then I went to a Web site on it and I am impressed by the specifications. Go to any or all of these links:
If that doesn't work just type in R134A+ in the search field and hit enter.
ScottComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
The rebuilder of the compressor and the AC shop that charged my system were both against Freeze 12.
The compressor rebuilder says its components evaporate at different rates therefore changing composition over time. The AC shop says it will ruin their Robinaire machines.
I was hoping R12a is NOT the same thing as Freeze 12 just new marketing. I am looking for an R12 alternative that doesn't cost $60-80 a pound
RandyComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
Both Freeze 12 and Autofrost have been around for 5+ years and have proven themselves.Comment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
Thanks Scott
If you have the R12 I would dump it into one of my cars. R134a works fine in cars designed for it because the condensors are adequately sized. That's the problem with retrofits, the R12 condensors are too small the cool down the R134.
R134a is a good start to be sure you don't have any leaks, its relativly cheap.
I have not had any leaks for over a year. Now I am looking at R12 or an economic alternative.
RandyComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
One of the major problems with any of the alternative refrigerants, Autofrost, Freeze 12, etc, is that no one is set up to recover it. It will contaminate the recycling equipment. EPA does approve these alternate products, but does not address the quality nor the compatibility. DO NOT use any product containing propane. There are/were some products on the market that contained propane. Imagine a leak inside the car while you are lighting your favorite tobacco product!
R-12 is still obtainable for use, abeit at a higher cost. I recommend that if you just need to top off your system containing R-12 take it to a shop that has this in stock. If you suffer a catastrophic failure in your system (compressor, evaporator, etc) it is recommended that you convert your system to R-134 a and always replace the dryer and the condenser. The reason being on the condenser is that it is a great trap for the gunk and junk in your AC system. If your car is new enough to have an orfice tube, purchase the blue tube, or even better the variable unit. You do not have to replace any o-rings that you do not disturb. Change the refrigerant oil to what comes with the change over kit. There is controversy as to which is the best, but it is definately not the oils used with R-12. Evacuate the system for at least one hour (I like at least four or more hours), check for leaks, and then recharge the system using the recommended amount of R-134-a remembering it is quite a bit less than required for R-12. It is quite responsive to 1/2 ounce too much or too little. I have converted several systems over using this procedure and have been quite pleased with the results. One '72 will give you 38 degrees in the right duct. As cold as any R-12 unitDick WhittingtonComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
Yes, I know. I am willing to try a new product and if it doesn't work out then I can fall back to the other ones on the market. I am using my '93 Blazer for the test vehicle and maybe my '66 Impala but so far I want to keep my '70 Corvette with R12.
I'll let you know if it is a deal or a dud.
Thanks,
ScottComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
Every once in a while I will spot cans of R12 at a swap meet and buy as much as I can. I have six cans left and I may keep them for my '70 Corvette. I have heard that R12 is dropping in price and for sure the R134A went up to at least $3.00 a can to $12.00. Yet the R134A+ is still $9.00 a can so far. Go figure.
R12 is just an unbeatable refrigerant particularly at long stops.
ScottComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
Thanks, Dick.
Interesting advice for all readers to heed. I always seem to learn from my own experiences after I've already done the dirty deed. Oh, well. I will let you all know my failures as well as my successes. If this stuff fails I will tell you and then you won't have to go through it.
ScottComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
I heard in the last couple of years that R-12 was not the cause of the depletion of the ozone layer(which is why it was banned). Has anyone any information on that or related subjects? Thank you DaleComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
R-12 is not the Total cause of depletion of the ozone layer, but a contributing factor. FYI as of last fall Europe adopted another refrigerant for use in automotive a/c system beginning in 2007. R-152 a, the Euro standard, is some what similar to R-134-a but less poluting. There is some serious experienting going on is the US. One uses CO 2 for a refrigerant. Red Dot manufacturing has an alternate refrigerant unit on the market for heavy duty extreme service applications. I cannot remember what it is using. R-134-a is apparently a stop gap product that will be replaced soon with the latest and greatest product.Dick WhittingtonComment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
1. Here's the school you asked for:
2. I converted a civilian car from R-12 to R-134a. Worked great. Problem with R-134a is that it is slightly less efficient than R-12. That's a problem with marginal systems. But not usually with the typically robust American systems. If you do convert, don't take short cuts. Do it the right way, and it should work fine.
3. All these other refrigerants are snake oil. If they were any good, the OEMs would use them. Check the ingredients. Some of them contain propane.Comment
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Re: R-134A+ (Plus) refrigerant
I read the same thing but have not heard or read anymore since. I'm thinking that the recovered R12 was somehow cleaned and rebottled as R12 but the prices have fallen. I just saw a 30 pound bottle for $425 (about $15 per pound). It can be bought for less. R134A is hitting $12.00 a small can now. The difference is negligible when desiring and attaining honestly cold AC and not compromising your vintage AC system.
ScottComment
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