C2 Tampered VIN tag

[Tom K.]

I recently had a disappointing experience purchasing a '64 convertible. I found a two owner unrestored car with lots of documentation, including a log of all maintenance back to 1972 when it was purchased by the 2nd owner, and copies of previous titles. It had a never hit body with original paint(not great shape), radiator, jack/tools, and even most labels/stickers. While the engine and VIN tag matched the VIN on the titles, upon closer investigation, it was obvious that the VIN tag had been tampered with. In fact it looked like it may have been a new replacement. While I walked away from the purchase, since I didn't know what to believe after that, I would like to get some opinions about how a replacement VIN tag affects value; potential problems with Motor Vehicle; and any innocent reasons this happens.

[Joe L.]

Re: C2 Tampered VIN tag

Tom------

There are not too many "innocent" reasons that a VIN tag is replaced and there are NONE with respect to a tampered VIN tag, assuming that by tampering you mean something other than replacing it.

In some states it is legal to affix a replacement, reproduction VIN tag IF, AND ONLY IF, it is done with the approval of and under the supervision of state authorities. Obviously, in these cases one must be able to demonstrate incontrovertable proof that one owns the car to which the VIN tag is to be attached. Just showing up with a car with no VIN tag and an ownership certificate showing that one owns a similar year and model car of the VIN that one wants to attach is NOT going to be anywhere near enough (at least, not in California).

In a case like the one that you've encountered an inspection of the car's frame stamped VIN is one of the most important things to do. If the VIN derivative stamped on the frame matches the VIN, I'd say that it's a pretty safe bet that the car is "clean". This would be especially true for an obviously unrestored car since it would be impossible to tamper with the frame-stamped VIN with the body on the frame.

If there is NO VIN derivative stamped on the frame or if the VIN derivative does not match the VIN plate affixed to the car, that spells REAL trouble or, at least, more trouble than I'd want to get involved with. If the VIN derivative stamped on the frame does not match the VIN plate, I'd report the car to the local police or DMV officials and let them sort it out.

Quite frankly, when purchasing any of these old cars, especially at the prices they sell for today, it really behooves the owner to inspect the frame-stamped VIN derivative, even though this is a difficult thing to do. It is VERY easy for a car of these early model years to have been given a new identity at some point in it's life as VIN plates for these cars are extremely easy to transfer from one car to another. In most cases, the transfer can be undetectable.

[Michael H.]

Re: C2 Tampered VIN tag

Tom,

Could you describe exactly what you mean by "tampered with? Did it not look like an original tag or was there some reason, possibly the way that it was attached, that you suspect it has been changed?

[Tom K.]

Re: C2 Tampered VIN tag

Joe/Micheal, thanks for your responses. I'll try to clarify the condition. The VIN tag looked like a replacement. It was shinier and lighter in color than the Trim tag and the rivets appeared to have been drilled out. It looked like the center had been drilled, just leaving the outer portion of the rivet. In fact the rivets didn't appear to be holding the tag on. I assumed it was attached with glue, but I wasn't about to try removing it.
I was buying the car from the son of the second owner (1972-present). His father died in an accident in 2001 and it has taken 3 years to clear up his estate. He mentioned that he had the car checked by some corvette 'experts'. I think they may have told him about the missing VIN and this was an attempt to correct the problem. My problem now is to decide whether to offer less money or just walk away from this car.

[Wayne W.]

Re: C2 Tampered VIN tag

The serial plate is make from a different material than the trim tag, so it is not unusual for them to be different. It should be spot welded on a 64 and sometimes they come off, so that could be why it is now riveted. I would check the number on the frame as previously suggested.

[Peter M.]

Re: C2 Tampered VIN tag

Joe,

where do you look on the frame for the VIN for a 70-72?

Thanks

Peter

[Joe L.]

Re: C2 Tampered VIN tag

Peter-----

All 1963-82 Corvettes have the VIN derivative stamped on the top surface of the left side frame rail. Usually, it is just rearward of the welded-in crossmember behind the differential crossmember. There is just a small amount of space between the body and the frame rail at this location. The top of the frame rail has to be first thoroughly cleaned with a brush and rags. Then, it will require a mirror to see the stamping.

An additional stamping location for the VIN derivative is the top surface of the left side frame rail at about the location of the center cross member. This location cannot be seen with the body on the frame, though.