Repost on exhaust manifold bolt washers

[Michael H.]

Wayne Midkiff posted a few days ago and asked about the JG calling for exhaust manifold bolt washers on all twelve locations for a 65 small block. John Hinckley and I responded but I think we were the only ones and I also asked if this was indeed what was in the JG but no one responded. Does anyone happen to have a current 65 JG handy? If this is the case, I would definitely say the manual needs to be corrected on this. I've never seen any 60's or 70's cars with washers in the center two positions.

Michael

[Donald T.]

Re: Repost on exhaust manifold bolt washers

I have the fourth edition of the '65 JG. It states, "Washer (spacer)is used between the French lock and manifold. Washers (spacers) are used under all bolts."

[Michael H.]

Re: Repost on exhaust manifold bolt washers

Thanks Don. That sounds easy to correct. If the words "except the two center positions" are added to the end of the last sentence "washers are used under all bolts", that would clarify the issue. That's probably what the original statement was meant to convey but the meaning somehow got lost in the text. The writer probably meant "all bolts under the lock straps".

[Donald T.]

Re: Repost on exhaust manifold bolt washers

also might want to see what the new 5th edition states on the topic. There may have been an update since my 4th edition. I'm one edition behind, which is pretty much the story of my life!

[Jack H.]

The 5th edition splits the subject....

between SB and BB. In the SB description, the text reads:

"Washers (spacers) are used under all bolts."

In the BB text the JG reads:

"Washers (spacers) are used on cylinders 1,7,2 and 8."

Looks like the National Team Leader INTENDED there to be a distinction to me because of the specific difference in descriptive text used. That says it's up to those who disagree to take their position(s) to the NTL directly. Your copy of NCRS Restorer Magazine lists a correspondence address for Dale Fiet (he's NOT into email BTW).

[Michael H.]

Re: The 5th edition splits the subject....

So, does anyone know Dale Fiet well enough to call him on Wednesday or do we have to write a letter? I'd like to hear what Dale has to say on this issue.

I'm assuming everyone here agrees that the manual is incorrect on this?

[Jack H.]

Re: The 5th edition splits the subject....

His phone number is published along with his correspondence address in Restorer magazine. Work through the system, not around it.... There's no requirement in the current 'system' for NTL's to monitor this discussion board.

[Michael H.]

Re: The 5th edition splits the subject....

Yes, I understand that Jack, but I first wanted to make sure I wasn't alone on this so I posted on the DB to get some input from members. I thought EVERYONE knew there were no washers on the two center bolts. There was almost no input so I decided it was a waste of my time. If no one else cares, I don't think I and a few others should be the only ones that do. I was only trying to help with the on going corrections process. I don't even own a 65.

If only three people bothered to peck a few keys on a keyboard on the DB, just exactly how many can we expect to actually make a phone call or write a real letter? I feel like I'm one of the only people here that ever questions some of the things in the manual. I should have learned my lesson on the 63 F.I. air cleaner "S" tube screw deal. I dislike the way people partition themselves away from what the rest of the organization is doing or thinking. NCRS wasn't that way when I first joined in the 70's so I don't understand why it's that way today. It reminds me of our local government here in Florida. They make the rules and if ya don't like it, go away. Someone else will take yer place. I supp[ose that's probably only three people bothered to get involved in this deal. They knew it was a waste of time. I didn't.

Regards,

Michael

[Patrick H.]

Re: The 5th edition splits the subject....

Michael,

FWIW, none of my 70-72 small blocks ever had washers for the center two bolts. I didn't chime in because I, too, don't have a 65.

I suspect the sentence, as quoted here on the board, was edited incorrectly. I suspect that "Washer (spacer)is used between the French lock and manifold. Washers (spacers) are used under all bolts." means that washers were used under all bolts WHICH USE FRENCH LOCKS (I don't know how to italicize - so I capped).

Unfortunately bad editing won out.

Maybe someone will catch Dale at Carlisle and tell him. I don't think that correcting the errors is ever something we should stop doing nor is it a waste of time. I suspect that few here may know Dale, and aren't much in favor of calling someone they've never met to point out an error. It's much easier to do so "anonymously" via e-mail but Dale doesn't "do" e-mail.

Patrick

[Michael H.]

Re: The 5th edition splits the subject....

Thanks Patrick,

That was my point exactly. I'm sure that Dale was not aware of the error in the manual or he would have changed it but either way, it still causes destruction to original cars and this is exactly what I've been trying to prevent here. The manuals MUST be as accurate as possible, even if it takes posting this information on the board instead of trying to contact our congressman. More later, I'm late for an appointment and I'm to worked up right now to be logical on this matter. How many people are going to run out to their garages and add washers to their car before this problem is actually corrected? How many untouched original cars will show up at the next meet with four extra washers on the exhaust manifold bolts. My arguement is not with the judge but with the outrageous way the members are treated when they discover a glaring error in the manual. Something has to change and it has to happen fast! These original cars aren't goiung to be around forever, especially if we keep supplying bogus info to the owners. I know I'm not making more friends on this, again, but I really don't care about that. The cars are my main concern. Hopefully, they'll still be around after some of us are gone.

It's not just the manifold bolt issue. It's the big expensive items also. Last month, we discussed the caliper casting numbers for 66 and everyone agreed they were wacko in the JG but how many people spent a lot of cash finding and buying incorrect calipers for their cars before that discussion took place? How many correct original calipers were tossed because the manual said they were incorrect. Is it corrected now? Has everyone been advised of the changes that should have in the manual to begin with? I better get ready for my appt. (blonde)