Cost to restore 40,000 mile '69 BB? - NCRS Discussion Boards

Cost to restore 40,000 mile '69 BB?

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Larry Clain

    Cost to restore 40,000 mile '69 BB?

    I am a new member so excuse my asking this question. I think I know the answer to this but the expertise on here is just so knowleagable that I feel that I must ask this just in case I am mistaken. It never hurts to have a different point of view.

    I am needing to restore a 40,000 69 BB 435hp. Cpe. It has been modified by Baldwin Motion and in fact is the #1 Vette that he sold. I have pic's of it on the cover of Cars magazine (Aug, 69) so I know what it needs to take it back to that condition. My question is why is it so expensive to do something like this. I see some stating that the cost is 20 to 40 grand. I find that a little unbelieaviable if one is able to do all the work themselves?

    Most everything on my car is original as in the article, so it should only need to be dissasmbled and be repainted, rebuilt, and replate the chrome and new carpet. I can do the paint and body work and I have the paint already striped off. I can't see why the huge cost unless you can't do the work yourself. I am a retired bodyman so my only expense is materials and my time which is a labor of love.

    The mechanical work is no problem as I bult race motors for my 69 SCCA B/P ex-L88 car. I may have the TH-400 done by someone as I hate to go through that hassle again. I may just put new seals in it and see if I can't get away with it as it only has 5,000 mi on the trans rebuild. NO big deal to pull it back out later if I have to.

    I do have 3 things to change back that I know that I need right off if anybody can help?

    Factory black leather seats for a 69. I was so smart back in 76 and swaped my original factory Leathers for a set out of a Highback 70's Leather seat optioned car that I wholesaled off my car lot. (If anybody bought a 70's car with 69 black leather seats, please call me? - WE NEED TO TALK) I perfer the later seats but they don't belong in this car.

    The factory side exaust covers have blistered and I don't know if I should have them (Plastic) replated or try to find a new set. I know this may cost some bucks but that would be worth it if I can find a NOS set of covers.

    Last but not too expensive is the car was hit from behind and I need to replace the taillight panel and part of the rear deck which I already have the parts for but the rear exaust blockoff lower panel with the exaust outlets blocked off for a factory car is damaged and I would rather replace it as someone used glass cloth on the back side to refinforce it for some reason to cover the original outlets. According to the tank sticker it came from the factory with them blocked off. I can see where the factory used a black plastic looking plug on a std outlet panel with the same bondo that they used on the bonding strips? Then someone used glass cloth to go over or reinforce it, after the car was delivered???

    I know this is not a "NCRS" as factory delivered restoration but it is a car that should be restored for posterity none the less. Thanks for taking the time to read this and for any thoughts you may have on this matter.

    The link below is a Magazine article on my car.




    Magazine article (go to very bottom of page)
  • G B.
    Expired
    • December 1, 1974
    • 1407

    #2
    Neat '69

    Does it now have the fender top exposed headlights? I can't see them in the magazine photos.

    I used to lust after that particular car back in school. I think Motion may have used its photo in their magazine ads for years.

    Comment

    • William V.
      Expired
      • December 1, 1988
      • 399

      #3
      Re: Cost to restore 40,000 mile '69 BB?

      Larry

      There was a TV documentary series called a car is reborn. This followed the process of a total restoration of an original and complete 64 or 65 XKE where the owner did much of the labor. On the last episode it was revealed that the restoration cost 85,000 English pounds (labor and parts). That's around $140,000 US. Reconditioned and new parts were a major expense.

      Good luck with your 69BB

      Comment

      • Bob R.
        Extremely Frequent Poster
        • June 30, 2002
        • 1595

        #4
        Re: Neat '69

        The cost to restore this car depends on your idea of restore. You are correct that installing new carpet and seat covers, painting the car, new chrome on the bumpers won't add up to 20 - 40 k. If this is your intent you'll have a nice looking driver. To restore a car completely the car would have to be dissambled and all the major components would need restoration. The gage cluster, dash, master cylinder, suspension, alternator, starter, carb, windshield wiper motor ect. It all depends on your future plans for the car.

        Comment

        • Chuck R.
          Expired
          • April 30, 1999
          • 1434

          #5
          Re: Sweet Larry!

          I love the gill, rear window and paint treatment.

          Man that takes me back

          Chuck 32205

          Comment

          • Mike Cobine

            #6
            Re: Sweet Larry!

            If you had been at Nashville, you could have seen cars like that again. The north side had the NCCC show, and they were loaded with cars built to suit their owners. Even a black '53.

            Comment

            • Chuck S.
              Expired
              • April 1, 1992
              • 4668

              #7
              Agree...Obviously Parts And Services...

              Are where the big money is invested if you can do the restoration yourself, and as Bob says, it depends on how deep you want to go.

              If you do a full frame-off restoration to factory original condition where EVERY component is rebuilt or restored, you can easily have $25K-$30K in parts, services, and materials. This assumes that a car is fairly original with most of its original parts, and that the restorer does not have to find and replace major components (frame, engine/driveline, body clips, etc). If the restorer has to find a transmission, correct engine, or other big parts, restoration cost could easily exceed the top end of the range you were given.

              If you can do more of the work yourself, you will be able to do the restoration cheaper, BUT...there is a lot of stuff that is better left to people who know what they're doing. For example, if you have a little noise in the differential, you will need to be an excellent technician or farm it out (ka-ching $$$). The same is true for rear control arms/rear wheel bearings (ka-ching $$$).

              In my opinion, the $20K-$40K you were given is for a DYI, frame-off, NCRS, factory-original style restoration. If you are not restoring to that basis, then there is no way to put a price on it without figuring out what you're going to do, pricing the parts (and/or services), and adding up the numbers.

              You have a unique car with high value potential, and one that will justify the investment necessary to do first class restoration. Don't screw it up with a poor restoration. In fact, if you have already stripped it, I would get it painted; but then, I would probably join NCRS, get involved, learn everything I could about restoration, and when I had advanced to the point where I knew when judges were wrong, THEN I would turn back to the restoration.

              Comment

              • Loren L.
                Extremely Frequent Poster
                • April 30, 1976
                • 4104

                #8
                It would be interesting to see some photos

                of the car as you go through the process, just to see how and what Baldwin did.

                Comment

                • Kent K.
                  Extremely Frequent Poster
                  • December 1, 1982
                  • 1139

                  #9
                  Re: Cost to restore 40,000 mile '69 BB?

                  Larry,

                  Looks and sounds like a sweet '69 large block. Since you are/were a paint/body man, that should pose no problem. Engine work ... the same comment applies. You've been there before. The tricky part of a DIY restoration is knowing when to send out parts and where to send them. Then being sure you get your parts back, not someone elses. If you are an NCRS member, there is a '69 rear exhaust panel for side exhaust model advertised in the recent issue of "Driveline". If you're not a member yet, shell out a few bucks to join the best collector car hobbiest organization and a few more to get copies of the judging and reference manuals. It will be your best investment for the restoration and to meet a great family of people.

                  From one '69 BB owner to another, best of luck.

                  Kent #6201
                  Kent
                  1967 327/300 Convert. w/ Air - Duntoved in 1994
                  1969 427/435 Coupe - 1 previous owner
                  2006 Coupe - Driver & Fun Car !!!
                  NCM Founder - Member #718

                  Comment

                  • Larry Clain

                    #10
                    Re: It would be interesting to see some photos

                    The article on the car in the magazine shows it in pretty good detail. Since it was sold it has had the emblems removed and the holes filled. They also filled the front of the hood scoop to keep the motor from drowning in the rain. and then they painted it balck with Candy Gold stripes down the centerline and around the tail. The motor was bad when I got it and I put a different 435 hp motor in it. I also had to rebuild the tranny.

                    I will be working on a webpage to document the car and will post a link to it when I have some time. The next week or two is going to be a little hetic. I will be glad to sent a pix of the car if anybody would like one just sent me a email to pantera2@swbell.net

                    Thanks for the interest.

                    Comment

                    • Larry Clain

                      #11
                      Re: Neat '69

                      No "Datsun style" headlights. The car is just as it appears in the article except it was black with gold strips when it rolled into my life. I just like you lusted over the car on the cover and you just can't imagine the excitement I experienced when I had a chance to see it in person and then to actually own it.... !!!!!!

                      Comment

                      • Larry Clain

                        #12
                        Re: Cost to restore 40,000 mile '69 BB?

                        Kent

                        Actually I am a "NEW" member and I saw that rear panel for sale in the driveline that I just received this week. I think that what I should have said is that I do not plan to restore to the level of a purist "NCRS" car would be. Perhaps I am mistaken but this is not a car that should to be taken back to as delivered from Chev conditon like you would to a original car. (I will be doing just that later to my '65, 365 hp. S/N 000011 - 60,000 mi roadster)

                        This '69 is one of only 10 cars ever built by Motion and one of one that was built like it was. All the rest have the "Datsun Style" headlights and the Firebird louver style taillights. This was Joel's own personal car that he used for development of the back window and then he made the more ratical looking cars of which I also have a '70 complete with the BOS from Baldwin Chev. It has the funny headlights and taillights and came with a LS-7 454.

                        Labor Day, I met with Joel Rosen the owner of Motion and he confirmed the original owners name of my 70 car that shows on my bill of sale. I am excited that I own two of these cars and I feel that they should be restored back to as delivered from Balwin Chev not to original factory NCRS judging condition.

                        I realize that this is not the NCRS way but a car with its history and heritage after delivery from chev, should be kept for its historic value. There are serious collectors for these Hi Performance Dealer Cars. I was suprised at how serious they are about these cars. Don't get me wrong. I love to see a NCRS top flight car myself.

                        I will try to use everything on my car that is still good and replace only those parts that I have to. I will start by documenting everything by pictures. Then I intend to do a frame off on it. With the low mileage of this car most everything still works. What doesn't I will of course replace with NOS if I can find it.

                        I intend to do it right and I appreciate everybodys input. I am going to give it my best and if something needs to be done by someone else I will see that it is done right. Believe me I will be on here asking questions if I am in doubt of what is the correct way to do it.

                        If I do most of it then I am for sure it will be my parts that go back on the car. Time is my only problem and no mater how long it takes I will do this car justice.

                        I have horded a few cars like these for years. It was just before Labor day weekend that I found out that these dealer built, custom cars, were as sought after as they are. I just liked them because I am a kind of guy that likes something different that just stock. I raced SCCA B/P back in the late 70's and campained a 63 conv till a '69 Factory L-88 with out the motor came up for sale and I jumped on it and wound up quallifing it for the Championship runoffs at Alanta on a shoestring budget compaired to everybody else. I had to do everything (Entire drive train) and drive the tow truck to boot. I would not take anything for the experiences back then. I even got to turn down Paul Newmans Datsun in TECH because it was not legal to race against us in Club racing with his Professonal Trans Am car. I have tales I could tell about that weekend. He is some kind of neat guy. Of course they fixed it and blew all of us poorboy racers off, but just to get to actually talk to him in person and race in the same race is a memory I will never forget.

                        Sorry I am rambling thanks for the time you took to reply - All of you...!!!

                        Comment

                        • Craig S.
                          Extremely Frequent Poster
                          • June 30, 1997
                          • 2471

                          #13
                          Re: Cost to restore 40,000 mile '69 BB?

                          Larry - you are doing the absolutely correct thing restoring back to the Baldwin version not the way GM built it. It is a part of Corvette history as such and deserves that level of restoration...in this case, it would be a crime to restore it back to GM's as shipped configuration, at least in my mind. Best of luck and keep us posted on your progress!... As everyone else says, expect to dump a lot of money into the parts. It is very easy at the onset of these projects to mentally only consider the basic costs...my experience is what I think it will cost multiply by 3 on the parts....Craig

                          Comment

                          • Frank H.
                            Expired
                            • May 22, 2013
                            • 148

                            #14
                            Re: Cost ......so true Craig *NM*

                            Comment

                            • Chuck S.
                              Expired
                              • April 1, 1992
                              • 4668

                              #15
                              You May Have Misunderstood...

                              The direction of our comments, Larry. I don't think anyone here would recommend restoring this unique car back to the way it left GM's plant. That would be a stupid, criminal act, and would considerably reduce the value of the car.

                              The restoration figure you were given, however, is completely reasonable for a typical DIY, "back to factory condition" restoration, and the person that gave you the figure must have done it before and knows the number from experience. (Or, he jerked it out of...er...thin air and was REALLY lucky.)

                              But, regardless of whether you do a factory correct restoration, or commit to accurately returning the car the condition it left Motion's shop, the restoration steps are going to be pretty much the same. If the car is significantly different from a factory Corvette, the only possible good news is that you won't have to buy as many NOS parts; the bad news is that Motion parts won't be available NOS, used or otherwise...they will have to be refurbished, refinished, rebuilt or custom fabricated.

                              This restoration will be very similar to those done on old Corvette race cars, and I might add, not a great choice for a first project if you haven't done C3 Corvette restoration previously. Restoration means to "put it back like it was before": to do that, you will have to be able sort out what was done by Motion, what was done later by other "restorers" (candy gold stripes??!!), and what was done by GM. That will be a tall order for someone that hasn't at least seen the intimate details of how GM did it originally.

                              I mean no disrespect to your restoration abilities, but this will be a tough project. You will only get one shot at doing this restoration right...if the evidence of how it was done originally is destroyed in the effort, probably NO ONE will be able to get it back again. JMHO.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              Searching...Please wait.
                              An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because you have logged in since the previous page was loaded.

                              Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                              An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because the token has expired.

                              Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                              An internal error has occurred and the module cannot be displayed.
                              There are no results that meet this criteria.
                              Search Result for "|||"