$750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

[Michael G.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

shipping ang handling those nuts is gonna be expensive...

[Mark D.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Seriously, why is it the bolts with anything other than FP are 'not correct'? How has that been determined? Bowtie examples, survivor cars or benchmark cars? If anyone knows for sure that ONLY 'FP' is it and no other manufacturer was EVER used please tell this group how you know that...specifically. This way we can all learn.

I'm always eager to learn.

Thanks,

Mark

[Mike M.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Hi Mark, very poignant question and comments.
From a '67 perspective, I can only attest to the originality and history presented with the two examples listed herein and the numerous documented original, Bow-Tie, Survivor and Benchmark cars that we have judged and seen that had only the "FP" headmark.
Other than these original examples as reference, it may be impossible to "Prove" the matter at this late date.
Also Consider:
A. The JG only states the configuration without refernce to the haedmarks. Perhaps the TL's can provide their documentation.
B. Joe shows one part number throughout that production window only.
C. Finding factory documentation probably won't happen, probably didn't keep that data anyway.
D. One possibility of confirmation would be specific recollection, or better yet, photos by one of the GM'ers that was there during production.
Hopefully, someone can come forward with the criteria you/we are seeking.
See you in Charlotte
HaND

[Mark D.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Mike,

Thanks. Poignant...meaning...not very political?

Like yourself and many others here, I judge for David and am proud to be a NCCB member.

Maybe these bolts are the ONLY ones EVER, but, I have also judged a few Bowtie and Benchmark candidates (although, I respectfully realize, not as many as you and a plenty of other NCRS and NCCB judges) and only want to be sure we know of what we speak. What are we talking about, 20,000 bolts or so? Maybe there is only one manufacturer, but, maybe there are more. Let's just be certain before we say this (these) are the only ones...right?

See you in June,

Mark

[Dick W.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Only ones that I have ever seen

[Mark D.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Farmer...

[Dick W.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Dang I did get a rise outta ya flyboy. Awful cold in that Pitcarin today ain't it? At least you do not have to dust any bean fields in weather like this.

[Mark D.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Left Orlando this morning in warm weather, crossed a cold front with lightning popping out the convective tops at 45,000 feet and landed in Charlotte with ice trying to hang off my 737 in 30kt gusts. A day in the life. All my 144 passengers were thankful to be earthbound again.

V1 Vr Gear Up....

[Michael G.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

As with any GM build, it is VERY possible that another bolt (or another supplier's version of the same bolt) made it onto a few cars. There are many reasons for such a substitution. If the plant temporarily ran out of the specified parts, or lost a box of bolts, or somebody just liked another part, or someone made a mistake, or several other reasons, a non-released part could run for months. GM very rarely stopped production for supply problems with non-critical fasteners, they built with what they had or could quickly obtain. (I was responsible for all the fasteners in several GM plants, so I've seen all of those scenarios and more.) I even know of one application at Bowling Green where a Ford part was used in 40 places on all Corvettes, for weeks, with no release, because it worked better. It happened ALL the time. Every assembly plant that I ever worked with had a list of similar parts in the plant that could be substituted in an emergency.

In this case, consider that all of the parts used in this application in 1967 probably fit in two or three small boxes (maybe four), so its probably likely that most of the parts installed in this application were from those few boxes, from one supplier (the one with the "FP" head mark). Its likely that that those few boxes were all the parts ever made, because this is a part easy to substitute for in service. As such, if any problem occurred, or estimated production was exceeded, the materials guys would probably find another similar part in the plant and substitute it, with no record. I hope that helps dispel any "only one head marking is possible" claims.

Mike

[Mike M.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Hi Mark,
Yes, I agree totally.
The point I was trying to make, sorry, not very articulately,
was that the combined history of the original cars that we have documented over the years, is really all we have to rely on.....
and to make a plea, that hopefully someone could come forward with true factory data.
Incidentally, it seems that all of the responses from those who have or know original cars confirmed the "FP" headmarks.
I guess there will continue to be some things that cannot be proven empirically and may continue to allow for an element doubt.
HaND

[Mark D.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Which manufacturer was 'FP'?

[Mike M.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

Which manufacturer was 'FP'?

FP= Foolish People? mike

[Mark D.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

That's a good one, Mike. I see it now, it's 'Ferry Products'.

[William V.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

What's the point loss for hving the incorrect bolts? My guess it would be a small point loss and at the price of $750 for the bolts it would be hard to justify the expense.

[Bryan M.]

Re: $750 for 2 bolts, SOMEONE'S NUTS!!

That's a good one, Mike. I see it now, it's 'Ferry Products'.

I wish my one and only FP bolt was worth that kinda money!